What Happened Tonight...
This was going to be a comment, as I am WAY too tired to be posting anything new, but it got far too long, and I thought what the heck. Just write the story.
I met a really cool women in Zumba School tonight. Saw her and her husband BIKING to the gym (heh. yeah.) and she was there for the Zumba School. (yes, after biking to the gym from where ever she lived.)
It's hard to watch the teacher in ZUMBA as she faces you, and uses no words, everything is backwards. I like to be in the front, as I think the closer I am to the expert the better this is going to go and it is where the people who know what they are doing are, generally.
My as yet unknown biking friend was in the class, up front, and darned if she wasn't the best one IN the class. Monday's class had a lot of people who were good at this, and I watched my friend, but this one had a whole lot more people more my level of fitness and Zumba talent. (which is to say slight on both counts) I took to watching her to try and keep up and get the steps.
After the class, I talked to this Amazing Women of FIT, and asked how long she had been coming, complimented her on her FIT, mentioned I was just starting out and admitted to taking my cues from her for the last hour.
Must have been wine to her soul, because she told me, over the last year, she had lost 110 pounds.
Yeah.
She showed me a BEFORE picture.
Yeah.
How? Apparently, she eats right and exercises.
Apparently, that works.
Many of the other learners came around, and we had a fine old talk about FIT and they all had advice and made me welcome in the World of Getting Back Your FIT. It's like I got an entire new group of really cool friends who all want the same thing I do.
Can't start sooner than now.
And I'm going to stay in the front of that class.
Since we have, as yet, no pictures of this FIT, here's one of poor puppy Lola, taken by Boss, after her Bee Stings today. As of now, she is much better, and no longer suffering.
Love and FIT,
Lorraine
I met a really cool women in Zumba School tonight. Saw her and her husband BIKING to the gym (heh. yeah.) and she was there for the Zumba School. (yes, after biking to the gym from where ever she lived.)
It's hard to watch the teacher in ZUMBA as she faces you, and uses no words, everything is backwards. I like to be in the front, as I think the closer I am to the expert the better this is going to go and it is where the people who know what they are doing are, generally.
My as yet unknown biking friend was in the class, up front, and darned if she wasn't the best one IN the class. Monday's class had a lot of people who were good at this, and I watched my friend, but this one had a whole lot more people more my level of fitness and Zumba talent. (which is to say slight on both counts) I took to watching her to try and keep up and get the steps.
After the class, I talked to this Amazing Women of FIT, and asked how long she had been coming, complimented her on her FIT, mentioned I was just starting out and admitted to taking my cues from her for the last hour.
Must have been wine to her soul, because she told me, over the last year, she had lost 110 pounds.
Yeah.
She showed me a BEFORE picture.
Yeah.
How? Apparently, she eats right and exercises.
Apparently, that works.
Many of the other learners came around, and we had a fine old talk about FIT and they all had advice and made me welcome in the World of Getting Back Your FIT. It's like I got an entire new group of really cool friends who all want the same thing I do.
Can't start sooner than now.
And I'm going to stay in the front of that class.
Since we have, as yet, no pictures of this FIT, here's one of poor puppy Lola, taken by Boss, after her Bee Stings today. As of now, she is much better, and no longer suffering.
Love and FIT,
Lorraine
177 Comments:
WOW. That is amazing. And inspirational.
Sally, you are FAST! I just added a picture to it...Go back, wait for the others!
Its google readers fault - it told me you had a new post!
naughty google reader
I'm glad Lola is improving. when Shiraz was bitten by something earlier this year, it was the scariest thing ever - a rushed visit to the vet because she started having trouble breathing.
Well, glad you didn't wait. Since NO ONE ELSE SEEMS TO BE HERE and interested in my inspiring evening.
Hmph. Hiding Fiends, the lot of them.
Uh, Google know when I post something?
I use google reader...I'm presuming you published the post and then went back to add the photo? Otherwise it is REALLY scary
She doesn't need to wait!
Anyhoo, clearly you are going to rock this FIT at a whole new level, and you have a new group of travelers on the same path! THAT is going to be such a help/inspiration/kick-in-the-butt-when-you-need-one.
So, I am counting on you for more inspiration. I want/need to be better, healthier, STRONGER. I will prevail!
....I suppose a decent night's sleep would be a start.
Poor Lola. Life's Hard Lessons Learned.
The picture led to much laughing and sympathetic "awwwws" here at home.
With that, good night Fearless Leader (and Fiends).
Tomorrow we Kill Moosk And Squirrel.
What a wonderful person to meet. And the group sounds like it will be such a big help on your road to FIT.
Emily, I'm sorry to hear that your mom's treatment has to be so hard. Glad that things are going the way they are supposed to though.
To bed with me.
Tomorrow I'm going to walk home again. Yes indeed.
Me, me! I'm here!
I bike to the gym - but it's really close to my house. I have done one Zumba class, and liked it a lot. Your classmate sounds amazing. Tell her I said that.
Poor Lola. My mom's late catahoula, Callie Mae, was once bitten by a rattlesnake. She was protecting my stepfather from it. Fortunately, their vet knew they had rattlers in the area and had given them a little kit to use before they brought her to the animal hospital, so she was fine. Brave girl, she never even cried. They didn't know anything was wrong until her nose started to swell.
Google knows everything. Soon Google will even know when we have to pee, and there will be reminder apps you can download for it.
I'm here! I'm interested! It is a cool thing. I like to think a person's tribe is in lots of places, and it's always good whe you find more people who are in it.
Poor Lola Bignose!
Thundering here. Don't think it's a big storm, though. Just grumbly.
o tick
Hi ChiaLynn, I'm glad you're here! The rest of you too, but you know that already.
I am SO glad we don't have rattlers here.
They were great. It is nice when you find more tribe. I think most people in Gyms are like that. They KNOW how hard it is. I like the classes as it is a group thing, and after you've all had your butts kicked, you want to share it with the only people who know what you just went thru.
I have to bath tonight. No, no applause. I do it every so often.
After riding this morning, working all day, then ZUMBA tho, I don't think I could stand myself in bed.
Exercise classes can be fantastic!
Going to bed...just finishing ranting at my sister about our mom - keeps me from ranting at Mom so that's all good. And sister totally gets it.
Emily, speaking of Moms, hope yours has some comfort.
That is incredible! Go her and go you!!
Poor Lola! Glad she's healing.
In-laws are in town...i'm sleepy. Work tomorrow and then birthday party prep for ben's party on saturday. Can't believe he's going to be 6 already.
Made our superhero costumes for his party today. Love it!
* edited to say "Damn it!! STILL can't get it to post.*
This is Vinity!
Very inspiring on the FIT. I want ZUMBA now but as I can BARELY get out of the bed at the moment, prolly not realistic. Plus, no ZUMBA in middle of frelling no-where NC :( . Still after they do the thing to my back Tuesday hopefully I will be back with the exercise program! And riding! Lance and Vin will miss 2 1/2 weeks from this back crash. *stupid back*
Poor poor Lola puppy! How did she get stung so many times?
Yay, not too silly out of druggy Vin :D You thought I was gonna talk about Wooley Worms again, huh?
Still Vin. It posted but I still got Error. LOL
Jess~ There is an AP that tells you at what point in a movie you can go pee and not miss anything important. I forget the name of the AP but I had a friend who used it. LOL As we went into the movie she set her watch alarm to go off so we could pee at that point LOL
Poor Lola. :(
I am exhausted, but I am getting things DONE! I posted on my FB that I need someone to walk with me in the park and get FIT. I also sent a new apartment complex a town an email. They are preregistering for new apartments. I could get a 1-bedroom for $620. Right now I am paying $850 for a studio, but that includes utilities. I'm thinking with utilities it would be around $770.
ooh! amazing. i do like to hear stories of people finding that thing they love to do that gets them Fit - yours, Lorraine, as well as your new friend's and others.
um. not that it's currently inspiring me, i guess, to do so myself. but it's always good to know it can be done.
poor Lola pup. :( good to read she's feeling better at the same time i first read of her trouble. and don't believe i've ever seen such a sad-looking doggeh.
hurm. sleepy time here. i think if i could discipline myself to get regular sleep, that would be a good start on Improving Fit.
OK Vinity again. I'm damned determined I'm getting thru.
Poor Lola, she has a Snoopy type of nose in this picture!
Yeah for the power of fit.
Yay for fit, and finding tribe.
And poor Lola. Glad the benedryl kicked in for her. I wonder whether she will associate the bees and the hives with ouchiness, now?
Oh I'm SO glad you talked to her! You actually inspired a blog post of mine the other day, which was trying to encourage exactly this attitude: talk to the FIT people. An awful lot of us started out anything but fit, and we're so damn proud of anyone else who decides to make the same journey!
Yup, eating right and exercising really is all it takes. It may take longer than you'd like (certainly has for me), but every pound in the right direction feels like such a victory.
You're awesome! Hurrah for having found an exercise you enjoy so much!
Vin is back! I love how she turns to us when on pankillers. It makes me laugh. EVen if I have serious Horse Envy of her. She rides warmbloods, what I would, were I rich. And a better rider.
Hi Rachel, and thank you! I have always thought talking, hanging out and being with the people who are the best at whate ever they do is the key.
I'm actually really shy, but figured, who minds being told they rock???? And everyone was really nice, and helpful.
Slow IS the key.
Lesson this morning. This is where DIm and My Teacher, who I call She Who Owns It All for short KICK MY BUTT.
May not be able to ride Dim, he was REALLY sassy yesterday.
Is there not tea in this house?
Our late, lamented, Siamese cat, Entropy ate bees. More than once... never had any breathing troubles, but would come to me with this ballooning face and sad eyes, and a muffled meow. Very funny/disturbing. Only did it two or three ties, and the swelling never lasted more than a day... He'd get stung on the paw, as well...
I'm sitting in my disaster of a house, with a party here in two days, and cannot get myself motivated to clean. Plus I have now left it so late it mostly impossible. Why do I love the idea of parties weeks in advance, and lose all interest and become avoidant as they get closer. Ack. these are quite possibly rhetorical questions.
Sigh. Never mind fit, I have achieved fat...and glum.
Tick. And, things will improve.
Zumba sounds amazing fun - I assumed classes were only available in America but just googled it and found several near me. Am so going to have a go!! Me & my friend used to go salsa dancing, we'd take it in turns to lead, we were rubbish but it was such a laugh!
Been a tad preoccupied with work and packing for our move lately (we become house owners tomorrow and move on monday). Hope all you fiends are well :o)
Well they are your friends, and so, will understand. They might even HELP you, Dabbler. I do that a lot, with people who want to hang out or come see me, I say, suuuurrreeee, but guess what we are going to do.
It's hard to get House Motivated by yourself. I can't do it. I tend to wait till Spooky Teen comes to clean, and doing things WITH her seems to work. My office is like that too. I make Woodsman Hans come in and sit there when I achieve Piles Of Doom and need to jam it out.
Found an article about Zumba in Italian, so I have to assume that classes can be found locally. However, the article claims a calorie burn between 350 and 700 per session (i would assume an hour) and 700 is already what I burn in an hour (62 minutes exactly) walking the treadmill...
Grief, I'm tired just reading about all that FIT.
Nice doggie. :) Awesome you're feeling so strong. You ... not the doggie ... but Lola as well.
Lola looks like a sad doggy in that pic. Glad she's feeling better!
Your friend from Zumba is an inspiration! Thank the Gods for people like this who can inspire by their example.
With my own FIT I need to look at it in little tiny pieces so I'm not overwhelmed...and really take it each day as it comes.
Tho---I really like exercising alone...they are the few moments I have all to myself and can hear my own thoughts...I swim laps and I practice T'ai Chi...(I live in a city now and the amount of noise can make me nuts!) On the other hand? Dance is great! Ames
Oh dear god, there's a pee app!! We're doomed. When the machines are telling you it's time to pee, civilisation is just over, man. Game over!!
That picture of Lola literally brings tears to my eyes. She looks SO SAD!!! I'm glad she's better now!
Lola shows us how tragedy and comedy live less than an eyelash apart.
Fit excellent! Poor Lola, Mother Nature sure makes her lessons difficult and painful. But maybe she will learn bees are not much fun.
I'm finding these fit posts really encouraging! My best friend and I are about to start conscientiously eating better(we had to set an official date to start), and I looked up the local place that offers classes and found that they do offer both belly dance and zumba classes. Now I just have to get up the nerve to drop in on one of them.
Poor Lola.
I was never more comfortable in my body than when I was a go-go dancer at one of the local goth clubs. Am I in better-looking shape now than then? Yep. But I was MOVING and more healthy back then. Oh, to be able to stay up late enough regularly to go dancing regularly again.
Go dance your heart out for me! You are AWESOME!
Hey Fiends!
I was very polite this time and didn't even drop any hints that I might possibly have news. But now I can tell you: I have a story in the upcoming zombie erotica anthology Rigor Amortis. Lesbian zombie beach romance? How can you go wrong! *grin*
I am on such a roll... think I can keep it up for a while???
Congratulations!
Mistress! That's great! What could be more cool than Zombie Beach Romance.
I'm getting, well, kind of, it's sort of warm here isn't it.....
Don't want to READ about it mind you, but I am glad you SOLD it. Such things do deserve cash.
I do prefer my own summer beach romances with non-zombies, true. But the zombies make better stories!
It was a trivial amount of money, but a real live (undead) anthology! *grin*
Spoken like a true writer, on both counts!
Go my, Mistress of the Skulls!
Thank you! Not sure about the "true writer" bit, but I'm working very hard on becoming one.
Meanwhile... My cats are getting all literary and even Microbetta went up the ladder to check out the Sandman books.
I'll keep a sharp eye out for that anthology, Phiala. You're awesome.
Microbetta is truly the sweetest EVER!
My BUTT is going to the gym for some ZUMBA, despite the brutal beating it took during my lesson this morning.
All I need is someone to carry me, please....
Go go gooooooooooo ...
Your cats are just so gorgeous Nat..and I want your bookcases.
Phiala -congrats. Where can we buy the anthology?
Zumba...yah.
Oh, Lola. Ow.
Great class. I am kind of starting to pick this up. One, it seems, gets BETTER than more you do it.
Didn't get to ride Mr Sassy Pants today, rode Romy and learned Leg Yields. Which is kind of going forward and sideways at the same time.
I'll ride Mr Sassy tomorrow tho. THEN we shall see.
I need to do a Martin Millar Blog, the sequel to Lonely Werewolf Girl is out! I love both those books, got to read the second months ago and have been wanting to scream it to the world ever since.
So, I leave for an hour and walk down to the County X Fairgrounds to watch some horses and no on has been here whole I was gone? Didnt you MISS me????
Of course we missed you! But I was working (what else is new?): fixed the leaky bathtub faucet, revised a short story, wound a bunch of little skeins of yarn from a big cone of the stuff.
Had chocolate as a reward for finishing all that.
Now, time for the last bit of Hugo reading and sleep!
Phiala has been fixing faucets and doing something unmentionable to yarn and working on writing.
I've been trying to forget that Louie is missing for two days by trying to get past stupid Mandragoras on FFXII.
Glad you are enjoying your new workouts but am a wee bit worried you'll over-do it. Don't get injured!
I went out to fetch dog food, cat food, more litter and then I did laundry.
I'd have RATHER been here...
haha Phiala beat me to it with her own post.
This comment has been removed by the author.
Well, good to know there are THINGS going on! GO forth then, and DO!
I thought we were observing a one-hour silence! Yeah, that's it.
There are too many CSA cucumbers in my fridge. It's a cuke crisis. We cannot eat that many pickles that fast. Does no one understand this?
I went on this miserable diet years and years ago, where I only ate cucumber slices and cottage cheese for breakfast. It worked, but BLEAH. I have not really felt much enthusiasm for cucumbers since then.
Is Louie home yet PG? I'd be melting with worry.
I've been devouring one of the 3 books I got in the mail today. nom nom, new stories.
I'm busy being a slug. And worrying about everything I should be doing instead of doing it. I need a transfusion or something from Phiala.
I have ONE cucumber plant in the garden which has produced an embarrassment of cucs. No one could ever eat them all. Sad really.
I believe an Embarrassment is in fact the technical term used by vegetologists for a significant grouping of cukes. Like a Herd of geese or a Flange of gorillas.
If I spend more than a minute staring at the "post comment" button before clicking it, that means it's time for bed, doesn't it?
No Sally, not yet. He has been known to disappear up to 10 days in summertime but not this year, he'd only gone for couple of days once back in May. I *AM* melting with worry.
My indoor cucumber plant has been great but it's failing to produce the quantities I am able to consume so I keep having to supplement with supermarket cucumbers. There will be a massive glut of tomatoes at some point though.
Oh Lord PG, that's why Tysie is an indoor cat. I can't handle the stress. Hope he comes home very very soon.
i think Phiala needs a wand to shower pixie dust around! er. or something like that. if she wanted to share. like.
yay for new Martin Millar! it happens that we're placing a book/movie/music order this evening, using up a gift certificate. (it's not my gift certificate, but i can add my own item to the order...)
if it weren't for you lot, i'd never know when interesting new books and music and such were happening.
but speaking of happening - i got's a ticket to see Lady Gaga! i'm as curious to see the crowd as the show: who goes to her shows? teen girls? artsy types? all kinds of demographics? fiendish peeps? vi ska se.
PG, hope Louie comes home soon.
monsters are abed and it's time for an episode of Big Bang Theory here.
CX
Wow is all I can say. Your new friend is an inspiration. As are you.
I love talking to people and hearing their stories. I also love hanging around people who are the best at what they are doing. It makes such a difference in my life.
So many people are focused on why they can't. The people who are the best are focused on how they can.
That is why I follow your blog, Quiche. And that's why I love you fiends so much.
We're all about finding ways to make our lives and loves work. However that looks and however long it takes.
So awesome.
And congratulations to Phiala!
I am so late to the party, but stopping by to tick.
YAY FIT!!!
I still exist!
Dancing is my worlds favorite activity. Lately I had an injured knee (I, uh, fell. At a dance club. Irritating), but I have been getting it back into shape by hooping with the lovely hoop Chantrelle's sister made for me!
So nice to read all the Fiendly things here-- keeping up on facebook and twitter alone isn't nearly enough.
Morning!
Adri and Ticia, glad your back! FB and twitter are NOT enough, this is the place where the cool people hang!
Gaga concerts have everyone. More 20, 30, 40's than teens, I'd say. You will love this current show! I've been hearing about it from Kitty for months now! Bigger than her theater show I saw, which rocked!
You know, I hope we never end up talking politics here, but I will say the negative adds turn me off. I don't much watch ads, but the negative ones take half the ad to figure out who it is FOR, and what they are saying.
Also I think if all you can do is get up and say how bad your opponent sucks, well, doesn't say a lot for YOU now does it?
It does sound limited.
Actually negative (or even comparative) ads are forbidden in France (not sure about the rest of Europe, but I can't say I have seen any outside the US).
And good morning.
It's one of manic days (well. It's been manic day since yesterday, really), a clear sign that people are going on holiday as from ... today and OMG they have forgotten all these urgent actions!!!
So I get to be vice-consul of NO for a while. Serves them right.
Vice Counsel of NO! I love it. I'm having a strange morning where I got up at 6, but don't have to be anywhere till TEN.
And the email of the night didn't kill me. I now have close to an hour where I can, well do what ever, before nipping off to the gym for something called Total Body and Stretch, which ought to be fun.
The negative ads bug me. They are bugging me worse this year and I have NO idea what election is coming up when. Don't care. I am going to vote for the person who gets slammed the worse in ads tho. HA!
hi Adri!
LOL - I love Vice-Consul of No!
so there's a Princess of No and a Vice-Consul of No. is there a City-state or Kingdom of No?
cool to read that about Lady Gaga's concerts, Lorraine. i won't expect to be such an outlier (though that wouldn't stop me from going).
i agree wholeheartedly about negative ads. srsly annoying. they seem to appeal to the least-evolved parts of the human brain. i have a lot more respect for someone who says what they are For, than what they or their opponents are Against.
going to the gym again? that's awesome! i'm not on the Fit Train yet, though i intend to be sometime. what i find inspiring is how much you go about taking time and care for YOU. Mental Fit is important too.
You'll have fun Na, Gagas fans are great, so much fun, and the audience is as much a part of the show as the show.
It's like the only qualification for belonging is Do you like her music? Do you want to have fun?
I need to make time for me. I spend too much time working and need this outlet. My body is happiest when it gets about two hours of workout a day. I grew up an athlete, and before Boss, never had a job where I SAT all day.
I just know, for ME, that's the way it needs to go. Full on. Yes, I am not an idiot, workout can be walking, horses, in the ZUMBA I am not keeping up with the teacher or people who have been doing it for years.
I go at my own pace. It's just doing SOMETHING and pushing yourself. I do it at work, now I need to apply that to my body.
I was going to go to the treadmill again today but I had a day that was very much a treadmill (a very productive one, I must say) so I'll go home instead and dance some.
That ought to clean the inside of my head sufficiently for the weekend.
Made waffles with M this morning (he eats them but I don't) and now we are going downtown to the bead store, etc. Thanks for all the inspiration on the fit. I will keep it in my mind as we walk past the candy store. :)
oooo...poor Lola with the giant schnozz...
Congrats on the new Zumbra friends. Support is welcome always.
I am a very athletic person. I want an outlet. But at seventeen, I feel like it's a bit late to start a proper sport ... and I have the sense my mom would find it a bit weird and worry that I was going a tad anorexic again. 0.0
Emily, it's never too late to start doing anything you want to do (with a very few biological exceptions). If 17 is too old to do new stuff, most of the Fiends would be completely screwed.
College is an excellent time to try new things - sports, activities, academic exercises - but why wait? If there's something you want to do, do it!
#
I seem to be taking the evening off. I'm settled in the courtyard with the cat, dog, and a nice glass of gin&tonic&dogdrool. [truly. some horrid pooch stuck his muzzle in my nice fresh drink]
All I'm lacking is someone to fetch me pizza. Where's a cabana boy when you need one??? Or cabana girl, I'm not partial. As long as they bring food...
Thanks, Phiala. I'm not headed to college for a while, I think, except for the RI community college. Yeah, people laugh, or scold, but I don't want to go off to school, not yet, not now. Maybe later. Here's to a happier evening off and a cabana helper.
People are stupid. There's nothing at all wrong with not going to college right away, or at all, or going to a community college. As long as that makes sense with where you're at and where you want to be, then ignore them. [original version had stronger language]
Still, there are probably lots of opportunities for club sports, or local teams, or just people who get together and mess around with a ball or frisbee or whatever. If you want to try something, try it!
Pizza has magically appeared [really!] but is not ready yet, so I was forced to mix up a gin&tonic that does not contain dog drool. Wish me luck on keeping it that way...
No shame in putting it off for a bit. But you would flourish, Li Em. You really would.
YAY PIZZA, Phiala. And thanks again!
Well Jess, the problem is, what I want doesn't have to do with college. I don't see college as practical in part of my ultimate goals, but my ultimate goals are, you know, precarious investments. I still need time to get a grip after all the chaos that's happened since I was like fourteen. I mean, you guys must remember some of that fun stuff. Things are still settling down around here and I missed like two years.
Oh, absolutely. Fair enough. It's something you do when you're good and ready, if you want to at all. The point isn't that you must, or even that you should. But I don't think there's any question you'd be in your element. Hey, ex comp teachers like me dream of students like you, kiddo. ;)
There are, unfortunately in the case of some job markets, certain reasons that it's better to have a degree than not to have one, of course, but I've always had issues with that. It can make one's reasons for going to college not much to do with learning; mine were. I missed so much, and there's so much I never tried. If I could do it all over again, I'd think less about a career and more about what I wanted to learn, and do. But I loved being a student. I loved being in that setting with other people. I think if I could do that forever, I would. :)
College is really good for having time to get a grip on things.
It's about learning about yourself, the world, how to deal with it, and figureing out who you are and your place in it.
Learning about things you might not have known about. Making friends. Getting the time to finish growing up and getting ready, well as ready as once can, to be out in the world.
That said, I didn't go long, and I never really went to high school. I missed a lot. But I've learned a lot.
Those are my thoughts. I think Jess is wiser than me tho. Listen to her.
I can totally understand that. I do think I would enjoy it ... and thanks.
And Lorraine, I would listen to both of you!
So I'm gonna chime in here on the college thing. I am of course keeping in mind that all people are different, but I want to share with you my own experience so that you might have what little knowledge I have to share about the entire thing.
I wanted to go to college. I had a partial scholarship to a local arts school. For many various reasons, I did not go. I have no degree, and it is very hard for me to get a job that is not retail, and sometimes hard to get that. All of the job stuff aside, I missed out on something that I can never get, (even if I had been accepted to college when I applied two years ago) and that is the emotional and social growth and experience. Now being 32 and able to look back, and with my husband working for a college, so I sometimes am on the campus, I know I missed out on something great. I didn't make those friendships that are stronger than those made in high school. I didn't get to learn more about who *I* was and most importantly I missed out on learning how to socialize properly. I am learning a lot of those skills now, but it would have been much easier and much healthier if I had done them at your age instead of mine.
Just my 2 cents.
Cecily, its never too late to go, if you're able. I went back to uni as a 39 year old and actually enjoyed it so much more the second time around. I had more of a sense of myself, and this time found one of my tribes. Most of my IRL closest friends are from this time - not when I went straight after school. I've lost contact with all the earlier friends, even those I shared houses with for years bar one - and that was because we went on to work together.
Tonight I go to see Stephen Fry. Woot. Pete's not well, so one of those closest friends from uni the second time round is coming!
The college thing is one very close to me, because I went, on scholarship, right after high school, doing something I loved. Because I thought it was the right thing to do. Because my family expected it. And I did learn a lot about socialization in uni (and, Lihua, I think that's important especially for people who don't have a standard high school experience. I was the weird outcast kid in HS.)
But, I also think if I had taken a couple of years off before going to uni, I would have finished. Because I would have understood the value of a degree in the very practical terms of the job market. And there are SERIOUS ramifications of not having a degree. It's not impossible to do well; I have a great job doing what I love, as you know. But I had to start my own business and not sleep and starve for three years to get it.
Definitely go when you're ready-- don't do what I did and fail out because it's not really what you want to do. But also know that the advice you're reading here about socialization/experience AND about the job market and degrees is real. :)
I dunno about wiser, Q. Just done a heck of a lot of school. I've got more school experience than practical working experience; that's always made things hard on the employment front. It helps to have a bit of both.
What Q says about what college means was certainly true for me; both undergrad and grad school made me grow up, socially and intellectually. It taught me how to think and assess and apply what I know. I guess I kind of wish I'd understood that at the time, how important that was. I didn't really get the education part. I was good at making teachers happy, getting As, ticking off all the requisite tickboxes. But that isn't quite the same thing as getting an education. I worried a lot more about ticking boxes and making people happy, back then, than I did about figuring out what I really wanted to know, and do, and be. But you know: that's something that comes with time anyway. Nobody figures that out in four years.
Ramble ramble. Did I have a point? I thought I did. It's in there, somewhere, probably. :D
I went to community college for 2 years, took a semester off traveling aroudn the country w/ my boyfriend in a pickup w/ a campershell..bein' a couple of hippies. Then took another semester of community college then transferred to University. The first 3 years were social. I partied, i hung out and met people, i socialized adn there were classes in there too. I had really, not many friends and not many boys interested in my geek-self in high school but in college I did. It was a revelation.
Once I got to University I was serious about my degree an focused on my major.
Everyone gets their own thing out of those post-high-school years.
I also have had much wine at this point in the evening (and week) and could ramble on for awhile ;-)
opps. I know I read this post. And liked it. But I guess I neglected to comment or ticky box.
Will catch up on the comments ummm... tomorrow. 'night!
It's funny because I have always firmly believed that not everyone needs to (or should) go to college. But I am already talking to M about where he may want to go and what he may want to study. He will go. If I have anything to say about it. :) He can drive a bus or dig ditches for a living, if that makes him happy. But he will go to college first. That is just my perspective at this moment. No one in my family thought I was smart enough to go. And I wish they had. And I was never good at making teachers happy. They, honestly, hated me! I am just trying to instill confidence in M. So he can rise above. No matter what he wants to do. I hope he feels that.
And, I second Sally. It's never too late. I am 42 and just now finishing. Not because it makes me smarter or a better person but because it makes me feel good. I am going to show them that I can do it. I am...
I'm a big fan of college. But, I think that if you're not going to go to college, you should find a hobby. A real hobby. That connects you to other people. Like a knitting circle or a gaming group. This will help with friend making. (Or, fiend making.)
Also, I started all of my physical activity after the age of 20. Yoga. Dance. Whatever. It's not too late to start a sport.
Double also, I NEED ADVICE! I was flirting with a pretty girl, and she pretty much said I should stop fooling around and just go for it. I'm really good at flirting with people I think aren't interested in me, and I'm really bad at flirting with cute people if they show interest. How do I calm myself down enough to be geeky-cute-awkward-flirty?
Wendy, I know it sounds trite, but you just need to be yourself. Flirting is fun. But it's not the real thing. So just be you. Try this, pretend you like her but don't find her attractive. What would you do? Then do that. If you just met someone you want to hang out with but didn't "like" how would you behave? Don't let the "cute" in this person mess anything up. Ya know?
Of course it is almost 1:30 here so I am surely spouting drivel... Night all.
zumba sounds like great fit. i love how it is inspiring you. it's inspiring to read.
I second college, but you have to be in the right mindspace, i wasn't and while it was an amazing time, leaving college as i did made my life a bit harder. i really think it's a good thing to have the paper, even if you don't plan on using it.
today i start vacation for a week, and my macbook died. bad macbook :(
i'm using boy's an his is all weird and foreign.
monday we go to san diego for a few days. *twirls*
sally have i mentioned how awesome your hair looks?
tick-a-doodle-doo
I don't think it's ever too late to start something new (Sportswise, Amy Williams, who won Olympic gold in the skeleton Bob didn't take up the sport til she was 20, f'rinstance.. )
I can see why your mom might be concerned, but having the feel-good factor of being fit (or fitter) has it's own benefits, too.
So far as the college/university thing goes, I agree that it can be an incredibly useful and beneficial thing to do, even if it isn't an obvious necessity for your chosen career path, but taking some time out can be good, too. I've always slighty envied those who took a gap year & went travelling between school & university (although 18 year old me was too shy & nervous to do it, or get much from it... I guess what I really want is to take a gap year now!)
my brother-in-law-to-be is starting a degree in September, at the age of 38...
Not sure if any of that makes sense. It's early, and I'm not very awake. I think mostly I'm saying it's a good thing to do, when you feel ready, and university is about much more than getting a degree (although that's handy, too!)
I'm going to go & hunt down some coffee now.
why thank you Vampi! And now I admit - its not that colour anymore...now a bright auburn. It was too carroty for my skin tone and clothes!
I do have to say that if you're not going to go to college, you should have a plan. I have a friend who didn't finish high school because he had a plan. He instead got his G.E.D. at the age of 17, went to paramedic training, became a paramedic, moved to a different city with a friend who was going to college to be his roomie, where he continued to be a paramedic. He then convinced a company that he was so awesome he should work for them as a computer guy. After a number of smart moves, he now makes a lot of money in Washington D.C. as some sort of computer security guy.
I also have another friend who has worked for many companies, including T-Mobile and Expedia (or one of those travel sites) and makes six figures with a high school diploma.
it's not about the money though, is it. If you make wrong choices in life, it will eat you from inside out until you get sick.
If I could offer any advice from my own personal experience - don't live your life in order to please your parents, you will regret it.
I look back on the choices I made and see my mother all over them. Now I'm 39 and have no idea why I'm here or where I was supposed to have gone instead.
Sometimes our parents are quite different from us, so that the things that make us happy actually make them sad - and vice versa.
Important to bear that in mind..
Oh yes.
Also worth remembering that people change. It never hurts to have a back up plan, or tools (such as a degree, or vocational qualfications) to give you optins if you find your original plan doesn't work out, or works out but doesn't pay the rent, or whatever.
What are your long term aspirations, LiHua? (if you don't mind sharing - don't feel you have to, I'm just interested / nosy!)
haha..back up plan, sorry that made me laugh
I was made to get a nursing diploma as a back up plan. I'd rather ride on the back of the rubbish collection van then work as a nurse.
I got a Biology degree because I liked wildlife and one had to have a degree. Never managed to get a job with it. Oh sure, it look nice on my CV, it tells people exactly how much of a loser I am. lol
Morning all!
I had no idea what I was doing in school, or what I wanted.
Hmm. That thought was going places then stopped like it hit abrick wall.
I am going trail riding in the foggy foggy dew this morning. Apparently I need to bring coffee to my cohorts tho, who think this is too early for a saturday.
Not riding DIm, he is way not trail ready. Riding Bucking CHanel. She is going to go nicely today, I have new SKILLS you see.
I get all sorts of mixed advice about college. It comes down to this for me: if I don't want to go now, it's okay. If I want to go later, I should and will. If I don't have to go later, I won't.
Long-term, Marjorie? In all honesty, I won't ever be fully satisfied unless I can write. Full-time, someday.
As for socializing, I hope you all sort of know most home-schoolers are fine in the social world. I don't need extra practice. (I'll tell you this, though, those stereotypes about weirdo home-schoolers tend to be more truthful than most of us are willing to admit. But there are several exceptions.)
making your way with out a degree can happen, but it seems like a much harder road. taking some time off with a plan to try college is a good idea.
that said, you are a smart and motivated person, so i don't doubt you will excel at whatever you decide to do. i just want to make sure you don't discount university, because a lot of what you learn there isn't graded. there is a lot to be said about social interaction and independence. breaking from your routine and foraging a path, finding your voice. these are all things that tend to happen when you immerse yourself in university.
to be honest, i don't think most degrees really do much for work experience. sure there is definitely some knowledge necessary for some vocations, but think the real life lessons of college are self reliance and social interactions. most jobs you have to learn their specific needs on the job, so the requirement of a degree is mostly to weed out the people who don't have the basis in social interaction and commitment to finishing something.
I'm sorry, I have to pitch in yet again.
Look, it's wonderful if the University experience ends up being this poster perfect life all y'all are talking about but it wasn't for me.
Life happens to you sometimes and it can suck, but I never had a plan and if I had a plan the suckiness of life wouldn't have stood in my way.
Lihua has a plan. She has a passion that drives her onward and she will succeed. She may feel she is not ready for the college experience. She may never feel ready for the college experience and that is okay. She is not any of us and we cannot be sure that what we did or didn't do would feel the same for her.
...
This is making me giggle. I've just had this vision of Pratchett-like assembly of witches with a young witch in the middle, and all of us old witches are giving advice and bickering in a witchy sort of way.
Well, nobody is bickering here, but you know what I mean.*
* this does not, in any way, shape, form or intention insinuate that any one here may be a witch**
**not that there is anything wrong with witches. fine people, witches, I always said.
You know, I don't believe anyone here is actually giving prescriptive advice. It goes without saying that Lihua will make her own decisons, and find her own way. It also goes without saying that Fiends will share their experience, sometimes at length. (Which I think Lihua knows. ;) )
Li Em, I don't believe anyone here is making judgements about your home school experience, or your social ability. (A good number of us spent a weekend with you, remember, and found you nothing but classy and fun to be around.) Mostly we're reinforcing-- in one way or another-- what Quiche said.
Everybody's got an opinion. It just gets worse as you get older. Fortunately, opinions aren't demands. ;)
I think this topic came up when we met, Li Em. Having met you last year, and having gotten to know you a bit better since then, I would still recommend that you think small. Small liberal arts college, that is. A high school teacher told me the same, and he was so right. A university would have swallowed me whole.
A small liberal arts college is great for focusing on all the good things you can get from college that the others have mentioned. Especially learning for learning's sake, and building a knowledge and skill base that you can apply to anything you decide to do. And more people tend to be there because they want to be there, so it might be easier to find your tribe.
Yes, these places are expensive. But they also tend to have really proactive financial aid departments that work hard to help you. From what I know of you, you're the kind of student these places want. So if you see some you like, apply (when you're ready) and then work out the details.
I did take an unplanned year off between high school and college and worked. And that was okay.
Wendy, I'm gonna be blunt, cause that's what I do. It sound like you have the preconceived ideas of what you can do and who you are. You can do or be anything,if you just let yourself and let go of all the boxes you have put yourself in.
(((Grace))) I SO feel ya. My mom constantly told me that she didn't think I could do the things she didn't want me to do. My mom still gives me birthday card with messages about how much she loved to watch me dance and how I could have been so great. Yes, ON my birthday cards, and Yes she thinks she is being kind with those remarks.
Li, as for homeschoolers, my best friend went to public, did homeschooling, and went to college, she never finished her degree, but she learned about herself in the process. I have a had a lot of conversations with non college goers and those that went, and it always comes back to those that didn't go to college missed out on some very fun times. If UM had accepted me, I'm sure I would have had a blast and enjoyed every second of it, because now I enjoy learning. But I doubt I would have filled the campus fountain with dish soap and swam in the bubbles. (yes my hubby and his friends actually did that)
Jess, seconded. As I stated in my first reply, it is my opinion and my experience. I would have killed for adults outside of my family telling how they actually felt and what they actually went through. My parents offered no help with college and did not see it as important. My mom asserted that she didn't have a degree and she had a job. My fiance asserted he had a good job and never went to college so I didn't need to. Well it's 14 years later and she hates her job and the life that she is stuck in because she was complacent about it. But these are my experiences, take them or leave them, but I am happy to share them.
Knowing is half the battle!
Side note...I wish these frakkin hiccups would GO AWAY!!!
Sending anti-hiccups to Cecily.
I think seventeen, even eighteen or nineteen, is young enough to be PLANNING for University (and no, I would NOT dismiss the idea, ever) and sculpting the idea of what you really really want.
Thanks for the hugs Cecily!!! (have you tried drinking water upsidedown? ;))
Also (((((Cecily))))) Mothers are lovely but can be soooo...something heh
You are right Lihua..it's very important to figure out what you really want, preferably sooner rather than later. And if I may just add one more thing from my own experience - it's really useful to learn how things work and what is available and what taking certain steps would mean in the long run before you commence. In other words, it pays to be prepared.
..this discussion has been very helpful to me too as I'm in the process of trying to figure out what I really really want to do with my life now. And actually, I think I'd really rather like to go back to school. LOL
i forgot my most important thing i learned at uni, i learned what i did not want to do and who i did not want to be like. i found some interests that had never occurred to me such as architecture.
*twirls*
i think cat stevens singsa great point...
And if you want to live high
Live high.
And if you want to live low
Live low.
'Cause there's a million ways to go.
You know that there are.
You can do what you want.
The opportunity's on.
And if you find a new way
You can do it today.
You can make it all true.
And you can make it undo
You see.
Ah
It's easy.
Ah
You only need to know.
Uni is such a touchy topic for me because I didn't finish and that has been hard, and I get defensive about it some times because I'm pretty consistently surrounded by highly-educated people. The truth is, it just changed my life path to this point, made it more difficult in some ways, but I've always been the type to go my own way, even if it's straight down the side of the hill off the trail!
Fiends, today I am starting a vacation! A real one with a plane flight and a beach and I'm considering not bringing my work computer! I will be lounging and reading (book suggestions welcome!) and writing and it will be wonderful.
Wendy-- I have the same problem when it comes to flirting with people I actually like/think there's a chance with. I get awkward and then worry if I'm making the other person uncomfortable. Mostly I've been trying to remind myself that it's not the end of the world if I flub something. :)
Thanks Grace! And can someone please explain to me how one drinks water "upside down" or "from the wrong side of the glass"? Both prospects seem quite messy to me. And I have heard both things on BritComs and I have always wondered what it means!
I typically sit still and hold my breath deeply for a short period and it is fine. If that doesn't work I drink water while holding my breath. But for the last two days I have had hiccups just randomly pop up over and over again. Enough!
Vampi, I LOVE that song.
drinking water upside down
That's a little hard to do by oneself. ;-) Of course if I ever do try it, I will be sure to record it for your laughing pleasure. ;-)
Cecily, take a big mouthful of water, hold it in your mouth, then put your head between your knees & swallow. :-)
Marjorie, I will try that when they damned things come back.
On a different note, I know at least one person on here was interested about my growing up in a cult. My post is finally up on it.
http://thelorax.otd.com/?p=88
Wandering back to the whole Uni/education thing:
hue comment about being picture perfect made me smile. I don't see it that way: for me, it was such a learning experience, not just academically (although I loved that part) but in lots of other ways. Including dealing with unpleasant stuff - "friends" and relationships and living/working with others and making mistakes and being independent - certainly not perfect, but I (personally) don't regret it. And I made some very good friends.
I think one of the huge benefits is having lots of people who are interested in learning and discussion etc. Of course you can, & do, get that elsewhere ( here, for example) and as Vampi says, learning what you **don't ** want or enjoy, the kind of people you like to be with, or to become (or not) is a big part of it!
I went because it was kind of assumed I would, and there wasn't anything else I desperately wanted to do instead, but if there are other things
Other things you do want, do them. First, or as well, and I think your (Li Hua Emily) idea of it's ok now, or later, or maybe not, is very sensible.
I'm sure I had something else to say but I can't remember it (see where all that education get me, with the coherance an all!)
ooh-yes Li hua - we met you. No socialization issues I could see:-)
when I lived in halls of residence at uni the people who had trouble fitting in seemed to be the ones who were only chidren and who struggled with living with others.
I LIKED your blog post, Cecily!
Adri, a few suggestions for books (even if I have no idea what you might like or not)...
The Beautiful Miscellaneous
The book Thief
The Lacuna
Einstein's Dreams
Thank you LiHua!
Lihua: I have to add my 2 cents about Uni. I went immediately after High school, not majoring in philosophy like I wanted, but taking business courses as my parents thought sensible. I immediately dropped out. Finally went back at 27 for creative writing because I could no longer tolerate the limitations of 24-7 “intellectual” conversation with a toddler and the neighborhood children. Yes, my desire caused my marriage to fold as it was an inconvenience. And yes, there were other factors at work there and no, I do not feel sad this happened…it has all made me who I am.
It took me 7 years to get my AA at the local Community College because I had a lot of life to live as well, then another 3 years to get my BA (with a lot more focus!) What I’m saying…school will always be then when and if you decide to go. I think most people should take some time off before returning to school…it can be highly motivating! I sometimes wish I’d done different…I’ll admit to jealousy when I see 21 year olds brandishing a degree…and bully for them! But everyone is different and everyday life reveals new paths for us to choose or discard at will. Have faith in yourself and know that no matter what you choose there will be golden moments and rough patches. Good luck with your choice!
Cecily…to get rid of hiccups, breathe in and out of a small paper bag, like the one you pack lunches in, for maybe a minute. Really works!
Adri, I don’t know what kind of books you enjoy, but recent favorites of mine own have included the Patti Smith autobiography “Just Kids” and “Lovecraft Unbound,” short stories edited by Ellen Datlow.
Ames
Lihua, I would just like to say that, if nothing else, a well-rounded and in-depth education can only help you as a writer. I have a BA in studio art - trained to be a potter, and decided halfway through I didn't want to be self-employed, but finished my degree because it was what I loved. I also studied amazing things like glassblowing and geology and Chinese history. When I went back to school to get a graduate degree I found the difference between studying for the love of it and studying as a means to an end - employment. I studied finance (HATED graduate school) and ended up as a bank examiner, which was very interesting. It was the kind of job that would give a writer lots of material.
I also found that just having a degree is helpful in the real world of jobs.
Everyone - I have a story about Revelle - she got stung by a pretty big scorpion while in bed at camp last week. It's kind of involved and I put a digest of it on Facebook. At least she didn't end up looking like poor Lola!
I hear pots banging in the kitchen and think I will go assist.
Breathing into a bag only makes me dizzy, and I've had enough of that on my own this week! Ha!
This has nothing to do with Uni or hicups, but hey..Trying to decide: Drive in with the dogs or indoor in town and alone. Drive in is an hour away, indoor is right here, but no dogs.
Taking votes for the next 20 min.
GO Saturday night party!
Drive in...but mainly because I get to live vicariously through you going.
I say indoor by yourself.
OO!OO! I found one somewhat near me! Now when I get my kids back form their various vacations I think we will have to go!
I know I personally would prefer alone time. My vote goes to Alone Time.
And Adri, whoot for VACATION and book suggestions are as follows: "Eight Days of Luke" by Diana Wynne Jones (out of print but check the library), "The Three Musketeers" (MY FAVORITE EVER) by Alexandre Dumas, and a very delightfully funny and pretty Fiendish sort of book is "Parrotfish" by Ellen Wittlinger. Oh, and you would probably love "Climbing the Stairs" by Padma Venkatraman!! That's an incredible read.
Personally I prefer indoor with cats and outdoor with dogs. Since drive in is really indoor (i.e. dogs are in the car and don't get to walk or play) ..
Am I missing some obvious advantage of dogs and drive ins?
This is nothing to do with Uni or drive-ins, but oh my blimey, Sherlock is good. Seen it yet? Just watched the first ep. Yowza.
Yowza, indeed, Miss Jess. I just looked it up.
First chance you get, watch it. Really, really good stuff. I want the DVD already.
Sorry, but as in Sherlock Holmes? :D Good? Thing is I love me some Sherlock reading but have never seen a film version, much less the most recent ... um?
LiHua, if you ever decide to watch any Holmes I highly recommend the ones with Jeremy Brett as Holmes. The movie with Robert Downey Jr. was fun, but was not a true to Holmes story. Granted RDJ is delightful to watch for any amount of time, but Jeremy Brett too was quite the dream boat, IMO. I could watch that man play Holmes for HOURS. We own all the Brett/Holmes DVD's, and they are a treasure to watch.
The Jeremy Brett ones are hard to top. Absolute must see (and it's invariably on PBS, so hard to miss). This latest one is a Mark Gatiss/Stephen Moffat thing. (Which you will like if you like Doctor Who, which you do.) And it's got Martin Freeman in! I like me some Martin Freeman.
That sounds only TOO truly awesome ...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Oh yes, 'Sherlock' is great!
It's not a dramatization of the books, it's a modern version, with text messages and websites and nicotine patches, and it's great. (We get ep. 2 this evening)
I haven't seen the RDJ one- keep meaning to get the DVD from the library...
We started watching the RDJ version last night - I fell asleep in the middle, but that was not the movie's fault. I enjoyed the bit I saw, but it is decidedly not canon. Treat it as a fun Victorian adventure movie and you'll enjoy it, I think.
Hm... if I get this dyebath going, then I can have coffee and donuts and RDJ for breakfast!
Hmm, modern-day Holmes DOES sound cool.
I need to watch this Sherlock today, if there is time, seems to be late here, and a lot going on. Teach me to take the night off!
Had a blast tho, Beez came and met me at the drive in, which made it way more fun. I could drive someone nuts bitching about plot points and the nonsense of them, (there's one BIG one that didn't fly for me, they took an easy way out to get in a good chase scene, bad movie people, never sacrifice story for stunts!)
I'm glad you had fun.
I really want to see Salt...
I am currently trying to work out a satisfactory end to an Argument Scene. I am tempted to add explosions.
Mr. Jess's cousin says: It's not a proper movie unless it's got car chases, Nazis, or dinosaurs in. Preferably all three at the same time.
Does Salt have dinosaurs? Maybe it needs dinosaurs.
Explosions are good. Dinosaurs I can take or leave. Nazis of the 'Indiana Jones' variety are good.
I wish there was something at about that level on TV this afternoon. I am having one of those days today. If I ever get my hands on whoever invented human biology he's going to regret it. Also I broke a nice mug thisorning, I have run out of real coffee and I dropped the pile of papers I had just sorted in order to file them away, and now I will have to do it over.
It's just as well there is chocolate in the house, is all I can say. Grrrrrrr
Well, -I- had fun, plot points and everything.
Action movies = willing suspension of disbelief.
Like you said, if Tom Cruise had gotten the part the movie would have sucked royally...with Angie it did not.
Marjorie: BINGO.
Why have I never visited a drive-in?
I think ninjas would end an argument pretty well. With the added bonus of being quiet, unlike dinosaurs.
Need to go have lunch and finish my final camp letter in time to mail it at the airport. I don't know if that makes it get to Bruceville, Texas any faster, but it makes me feel cool.
SALT had Spiders, close enough I say. It's a fun movie, perfect drive in movie, or dvd movie. WAY better with Angelina than it would have been with Cruise, ugh.
The story diverged a bit when it didn't have to, I think they wanted more depth, but things got lost. I want to see it again on DVD when it comes out.
Feeling like I should go riding but lacking the oomph to get up and go to the stable. Dim was pretty Sassy yesterday, may just wait till my lesson in the morning and just take the dogs for a walk.
Actually, I should go and get honey. I need a frame, AND a ross round comb for the fair on tuesday.
Got to be better than what Will has on. Please, somebody rescue me from the terrors of "Big Time Rush"!
Thank you, Jess.
Also, I just found an old James Bond film on TV. It's half way through, so it's just as well that plot isn't a major factor...
As it happens, Fluff, I ended the argument by cutting it, because it was getting to the point where the only answer was ninjas. You know, I dunno about you guys, but I always find it very comforting when someone like Stephen Moffat tweets about having forgotten how to write, because I HAVE FORGOTTEN HOW TO WRITE. Thank the Baby Buddy Christ that no one's paying me to write this utter shit I've been writing for well nigh three hours now, because lemme tell ya: we're this close to ninjas, and that'd be me fired. Gaaah.
/rant
Sounds like flamethrower time...
No. That's for Doctor Who fan fiction. I haven't sunk that low. Yet.
It's a new Bee Post! And it's up!
Pack up your talk and bring it on over.....I want more of this flame throwing fan fiction chat...
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